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Old August 1st, 2008   #41 (permalink)
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Re: Event Timer Bug

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Originally Posted by swflscubadiver View Post
Thanks for the heads up on this. I've e-mailed Julie with this information asking for an explaination of the discrepancy.

Here's the response back, it seems somewhat good:

You're right. The website does say record and playback simultaneously. Let me check into that.

Thank you for your input.

Julie
FTA Technician
SonicView USA
phone 866-205-6571
phone (Canada) 248-240-1704
Email: techsupport@sonicviewusa.com
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Old August 2nd, 2008   #42 (permalink)
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Re: report your pvr results here.

I am really pleased that folks are getting responses to technical inquiries -- even if the responses are "I will check". I have dealt with way too many companies that seem to think customers are an annoyance. If SV can stay responsive and also solve some of these issues with a firmware upgrade, they will bubble to the top of this very competitive arena very quickly.

--------------------------------------------

And just to keep everybody up to date with pvr performance.....

I have been deliberately stress-testing my system, just to see where the limits are. Last night, overnight, I left the time shifter on 'auto' and scheduled two recordings that overlapped by about an hour, using just the EPG. Everything worked exactly as advertised -- both programs recorded fine, and the shifter was active when I checked it (I assume it was switched off during the overlap). I have a no-frills 500 Gb HDD, so I imagine this kept it hopping for a couple of hours, but all was fine. I will keep on doing tests.

I have had several pvr-related issues and difficulties, but despite those few, I still think this is one amazing box.
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Old August 2nd, 2008   #43 (permalink)
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Re: report your pvr results here.

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Originally Posted by SystemDude View Post
I am really pleased that folks are getting responses to technical inquiries -- even if the responses are "I will check". I have dealt with way too many companies that seem to think customers are an annoyance. If SV can stay responsive and also solve some of these issues with a firmware upgrade, they will bubble to the top of this very competitive arena very quickly.

--------------------------------------------

And just to keep everybody up to date with pvr performance.....

I have been deliberately stress-testing my system, just to see where the limits are. Last night, overnight, I left the time shifter on 'auto' and scheduled two recordings that overlapped by about an hour, using just the EPG. Everything worked exactly as advertised -- both programs recorded fine, and the shifter was active when I checked it (I assume it was switched off during the overlap). I have a no-frills 500 Gb HDD, so I imagine this kept it hopping for a couple of hours, but all was fine. I will keep on doing tests.

I have had several pvr-related issues and difficulties, but despite those few, I still think this is one amazing box.
Great info Dude. I wish I could say I have had the luck with my PVR testing. I recorded three movies over the last few days. Two of them were unwatchable, freezing 8 or 9 minutes into them. The other worked fine. And I recorded a 1 hour show yesterday and the same thing happened. I'm running a brand new Maxtor one touch 500 gig drive formatted in FAT32.
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Old August 2nd, 2008   #44 (permalink)
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Post Hard drives in PVR and A/V service

Sitting at the computer just now, I had one of those "light-bulb" moments of clarity. I have been reading multiple posts about folks that have made recordings where the playback freezes up several minutes into the program, never to be unfrozen, and other effects. I have had the odd similar instance, but certainly not as consistent as these folks (I have had way more successful recordings than aborted ones, including recording two programs simultaneously onto one hard drive). And besides, those symptoms sounded vaguely familiar.......

Finally I remembered. In order to compensate for internal temperature changes, hard drives perform a routine called "thermal recalibration". Here's what Scott Mueller says about it in his reference guide, "Upgrading and Repairing PC's":
"Most hard drives today have sophisticated thermal compensation routines that make adjustments in head position relative to the expanding and contracting platters. Most drives perform this thermal compensation routine once every 5 minutes for the first 30 minutes the drive is running and then every 30 minutes thereafter. In many drives this procedure can be heard as a rapid 'tick-tick-tick-tick' sound."
Data cannot be read from or written to the drive during the one second or more while this routine takes place. On a normal desktop computer it is little more than a fleeting annoyance - kind of like the machine needed to take a breath. But I recalled that this routine was causing nightmares for manufacturers who were trying to record real-time data such as video or audio, and at one time drive manufacturers produced a line of what were called "audio/video" or "A/V" drives which minimized or eliminated the thermal recalibration cycles to allow recording with no perceptible breaks.

A visit to the Seagate site uncovered the following quote:
"Since there is no industry standard for A/V-rated hard drives, there is varying opinion in the computer world about what comprises an A/V hard drive. Generally, the industry consensus for any hard drive to be A/V rated is based on a few factors:
Does the drive feature thermal recalibration? All of the Seagate recent and current SCSI and ATA drives feature an embedded servo that eliminates thermal recalibration, so this is no longer a concern with any of our drives."
Note that Seagate emphasizes that even though their drives used to employ that feature, their current models do not. And they further hint that other manufacturers may have differing standards for this characteristic. Therefore, such drives may still be being marketed.

I have now pretty much convinced myself that the folks that are having regular freezeup problems with their pvr are victims of this hard drive design characteristic. The only way to know for sure is to research the exact model number of the hard drive, which may not be that simple to do (opening up the enclosure, etc.), or ask the drive manufacturer's tech support people. There is no "fix" for it -- a drive which uses this technique is simply not going to record video successfully, even though it might run Windows like a champ.

It has also been brought to my attention that some drives have a built-in "sleep" mode that spins them down after a period of inactivity to conserve power. Although a PVR drive is unlikely to have periods of inactivity (since you are probably using the time-shift feature), it's also worth checking out this possibility as well.
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Last edited by SystemDude; August 6th, 2008 at 05:31 PM. Reason: Sleep mode added
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Old August 2nd, 2008   #45 (permalink)
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Re: report your pvr results here.

Dude, a thanks to ya for that great post (wouldn't let me send you a rep power again for some reason) which is well deserved for your post. I will have to contact Maxtor and see if this drive I just bought has that thermal technology you mentioned.
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Old August 2nd, 2008   #46 (permalink)
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Re: report your pvr results here.

i sent him some for you big frank,not much but some as i think his post are above and beyond also
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Old August 2nd, 2008   #47 (permalink)
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Re: report your pvr results here.

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i sent him some for you big frank,not much but some as i think his post are above and beyond also
Thanks Baron!
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Old August 2nd, 2008   #48 (permalink)
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Re: report your pvr results here.

Frank and Baron:

Thank you! This board was/is a lot of help to me and I hope to return the favour if I can.
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Old August 2nd, 2008   #49 (permalink)
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Re: report your pvr results here.

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Frank and Baron:

Thank you! This board was/is a lot of help to me and I hope to return the favour if I can.
WE will all just work together to make it happen!
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Old August 3rd, 2008   #50 (permalink)
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Re: report your pvr results here.

I noticed I can't move the files in the USB menu. When I select "move" from the file menu it pauses for a few seconds then opens the folder window but there are no folders. Also when I try to navigate up and down in the folder window, it selects the files behind it and distorts the window. I have to exit the menu to get rid of the folder window.

Anyone else experiencing this?
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Old August 3rd, 2008   #51 (permalink)
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Re: report your pvr results here.

I found that I cannot move files to the root directory of the hard drive. I made a folder in the SV_HDVIDEO folder and was able to move files into it. I have another folder in the root directory from my coolsat box but I can't move files into it either because it's in the root directory. Problem solved.
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